FE engine question ?

Originally Posted by JCAllison

Hey mon Deb,
The oil in the non-FE engine DOES travel up through the INSIDE of the push rod to the rocker arm, but I don't know of any instance where the oil travels UP the OUTSIDE of the push rods, optical illusionary or otherwise.

JC

You'll have to watch one some day with the valve cover off JC. I'm sure it's an optical illusion and the oil is only going up and down with the push rod but, it's possible it travels up because of the spin/rotation of the pushrod as it works up and down. I remember putting something against the pushrod as it went up and down to test that theory but now i can't remember what the heck the results of that little experiment was. LOL

JC is correct, the oil gets to the top through an ofset hole next to one of the stand bolts (I believe the second or third hole?). Two (at least two) things that can cause the problem of no oil to the top are 1.) using the wrong hold down bolt in the stand with the oil hole. The correct bolt will neck down or appear to have a slightly smaller size than the others. And 2.) and more likely if no oil is getting through to the top is that the cam bearings are installed incorrectly or have spun and blocked the pathway to the top.
FE's, especially ones that are operated at high RPM levels as in a circle track motor usually have a problem pumping too much oil to the top. This usually fills the valve covers with oil causing them to leak and often starves the mains of oil as these engines oil the top first. This is usually cured by installing plugs with small holes into the rear of the two lifter galleys and using a holley jet in the oil holes to the rocker arms. So if you have no oil up there at all start looking at the cam bearings.
Scott...

By the way everyone....

All ford 144, 170 and 200's ALSO lube through the rocker shaft

Originally Posted by ShotRod64

You'll have to watch one some day with the valve cover off JC. I'm sure it's an optical illusion and the oil is only going up and down with the push rod but, it's possible it travels up because of the spin/rotation of the pushrod as it works up and down.

Hey mon Deb,
This is the first mention of a spinning/rotating push rod that I've seen here, and I just wanted to say this about that: The spinning of the push rod is the result of the spinning of the lifter (solid, maybe hydraulic, but NOT a roller tappet). The spin of the lifter is imparted by the lobe on the camshaft not being ground absolutely square, which means that the lifter (at least this is true of a "solid" lifter) is contacting the cam only on one edge of the lobe.

I have the set of lifters that came out of the 3.14 in 1989, and the surface of the lifter that contacted the cam has a distinctive pattern worn into it. I've also looked at the cam that came out of 3.14 at the same time, and it has a distinct "non-right angle" slope to the cam lobe, and it slants down from the back of the lobe, which gives the cam the tendency to be held in an "in" position.

I remember putting something against the pushrod as it went up and down to test that theory but now i can't remember what the heck the results of that little experiment was. LOL

I know what you mean. I one time put all the components for a small nuclear device together, but that was some time ago, and I can't remember what happened when I set it off.

Hope you are well.

PUFE

JC

the under ground stand bolt goes in the second stantion-- the oil galley runs at an angle to the second long head bolt -- but my question is -- there seems to be very little clearance around that head bolt to let oil up in to the rocker stand-- -i did check and there is no taper or off ground head bolt --

the question is this enough clearance around that head bolt to allow oil up to the rocker shaft??

I do not recall any head bolt in the path of the oil passage way? I do not have anything apart at the moment to look a though. The bolt I refered to in my earlier post was the bolt that holds the rocker shaft assembly on to the head. However if the oil pressure is good at least some oil will pass with something as small as .03.

Scott...

Wasn't a mention as to if this engine was solid lifter or mush lifter. But each has a different way of lubricating the pushrod ends. On the solid lifter engine, the push rods are usually solid too, on the mush lifter engine they are three pieces welded together on a tube.

On a mush lifter engine, the upper and lower end is a simple ball bearing that got welded to a tube. At the end of the rocker arm is a little hole and it is this hole that provides the lubing. As excess oil comes out the rocker arm bushing it gets on to the whole arm. It then flicks around and into the little noted hole. This then lubricates the upper end.

At the lifter end of a mush engine, the exact fit between the oil bore and the lifter is clearanced. Oil then works it's way to side and top of lifter via the pumping action. This oil then gets trapped on the pushrod cup, and lubricates the lower end. Some oil also runs down the pushrod and gets trapped also.

On a solid lifter engine, there are zero oil holes drilled in the galley to feed the lifters. The main supply then relies upon the camshaft spilling in to the lower end of the bores, and working upward to the cup area. Again there is some running down the actual pushrod to lube it.

At the top end of the solid engine, the pushrod has a cupped end. The mentioned flicking around of oil then coats all of the rocker arm, and flows into the cup. Providing lube there.

It really does not take a whole lot of oil to lubricate the pushrod ends. This was all written out in some 1962 era booklet that Frod used to mail out.


Wm.

hold a sec Will, the oil galleries MUST be drilled to supply the lifters with oil or they would SEIZE in the lifter bores after about 3 minutes wouldn't they?

Nope....

I have owned a few of the 427 engine bloks. Side oiler and normal. The bumps are there for oil feed holes to be drilled, but they only get drilled about one inch. Not full length. On the solid lifter engines like the 427, and the very hard to find 390's they are not drilled for full length. That feature only comes when buying an engine set asside for mush lifters. I think most all of the Cobra Jet engines were originally mush lifters, and a few that were used in racing were designed for solid lifters.

I think the 427 and early Falcon six cylinders engines shared same lifters. I know size-wise they interchanged, for did that once.

I got a write up someplace on the pushrods for non-adjustable (mush lifter) engines and how they made them.


Wm.

Coosbaylumber is right. No passages drilled for lifters on solid lifter FE engines. Even real early 332 engines in '58 were solid lifter and used a shell lifter with a longer push rod that went to the bottom of the lifter. Then starting in 1960 the Hi-Po 352 used "dumb bell" solid lifters the same as 144-170 Falcon 6's. Hi-Po's all the way up to the 427's used them until 427's went ti juice lifters in about '68