Honda set to release first Hydrogen powered cars!

Originally Posted by FEandGoingBroke

You seem to believe I follow a right wing spin (not that I have a damn clue as to what that is...) But I'm only pissed at the praise of this miracle production of a hydrogen car that don't have emissions like NOX and Hydrocarbons and crap but it dos put out MORE carbon Dioxide than a fossil fuel powered engine and it still relies on fossil fuels to creat it's fuel...

There, I've said it twice but used diffrent words the second time

I thing there should be NO PRAISE for a hydrogen powered vehicle until it is TRUELY a non emission vehicle... Last I checked, carbon dioxide kills people pretty efficiently when concentrated, but it's good for the trees....

There I go being a smart ass without any knowledge to back myself up... Sorry, but If you want green make something fully green....
I phucking hate the word "Green" sometimes....

Sorry, I didn't mean to insult your politics, but most of the stuff you are citing is ripped from the corporate-oil right. I just don't agree with that kind of negative thinking. The same thinking said the combustion engine car would never be anything more than a fad. Why does a Hydrogen engine have to produce no emissions when a fossil fuel engine produces c02 emissions? it's a straw man argument. They already produce less emissions than a fossil fuel engine and give them 20 years to develop the technology (the fossil engine had 70 years before emissions reduction engineering matured) and I'm sure the Hydrogen engine will be much more friendly to the air we breath than our fossil engines of today. Also, the use of solar to produce the energy needed to manufacture hydrogen fuel (rather than using fossil fuel) is a technology right around the corner and probably why oil prices are so high.

Originally Posted by CWallace

Solar powered hydrogen generators using sea water as a "fuel". No fossil fuels needed. This does not solve the CO2 issue.

Figure about $3 per watt of solar power required - that won't help costs at all.

Originally Posted by PaceFever79

That's brilliant. Thanks for sharing your insight.

Thank you, I know it was. When you accuse someone of leaning one way or other and that they are doing nothing more than spouting talking points and don't know what they are talking about etc...it is best not to counter their position simply with the alternate view's talking point. Independant research here and facts would have been better. I don't have a horse in race 'so to speak' so feel free to slam me as belonging to whatever camp you want...just making an observation.

Originally Posted by bassman97

Burning hydrogen can't make CO2 since unlike fossil fuels, there's no Carbon molecules. However, Hydrogen can still cause issues since its main emission is water vapor, it can cause actual harm to the climate, more so than what CO2 can or will.

This might be controlled with a vapor collection device in the exhaust system that condenses the vapor back into water and collects the water in a tank. When the tank is full you would simply drain the water out onto the ground where it would return to the underground water table.

Originally Posted by ckelly

Figure about $3 per watt of solar power required - that won't help costs at all.

For a nation of (former) pioneers, this mentality is staggering.

It is also why the Asians are / will eat our lunch.

At the moment I understand it to be a zero sum game ... takes as much energy to isolate the hydrogen as the hydrogen can later deliver.

Over time that might change ... however I think the technicological advancement will most likely happen in the private sector and will happen because of "profit motive" just the same as nearly all advancements in America occur.

Originally Posted by MonsterMach

At the moment I understand it to be a zero sum game ... takes as much energy to isolate the hydrogen as the hydrogen can later deliver.

Over time that might change ... however I think the technicological advancement will most likely happen in the private sector and will happen because of "profit motive" just the same as nearly all advancements in America occur.

Or, it will happen in Asia and we will be left behind. The fact is that we know what to do, we just need to figure out how - that is a relatively sure bet that modern science and technology will solve the problem.

You didn't insult my politics... Because I have none. and I still have no clue what that wing schitt is...
I just think that people thinking green should think really green and then stop bitching.

Some interesting things have been written and I liked reading each post. I never knew burning hyd could be worse in certain way's.

I'm GLAD they're doing this Hyd rcar thing because it will take a teency bit off the oil dependancy, but likely not enough to matter...

And I fully believe that we will not run out of fossil fuels within the next generation or three like some seem to think. There were a LOT of dinosaurs

Many times the rush to a new and better technology is nothing more than another mistake to learn from. What we need is more leaders and forward thinking people to guide our country into real solutions instead of the next corn based ethanol fiasco. Is Hydrogen it? Who knows. How about electric heat source to produce steam to run steam turbine and turn drive wheels and generator to recharge electric source to heat water to run steam turbine and turn drive wheels and generator to recharge electric heat source etc. etc etc.
In the meantime DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW, SAVE MONEY!!! Neither left or right, liberal or conservative, just a way to reduce or dependence on foreign supply while we continue to research and come up with the FLUX CAPACITOR and HYPER DRIVE.

Originally Posted by FEandGoingBroke

You didn't insult my politics... Because I have none. and I still have no clue what that wing schitt is...
I just think that people thinking green should think really green and then stop bitching.

Some interesting things have been written and I liked reading each post. I never knew burning hyd could be worse in certain way's.

I'm GLAD they're doing this Hyd rcar thing because it will take a teency bit off the oil dependancy, but likely not enough to matter...

And I fully believe that we will not run out of fossil fuels within the next generation or three like some seem to think. There were a LOT of dinosaurs

Again, flawed propaganda logic.

Why does it have to be an all or nothing competition between fossil fuel and hydrogen? If Hydrogen power matures to replace 30% of fossil engines in the world (both transportation and industrial), and pure electric replaces another 20%, and a solar panel in every home reduces energy demand by 50%, the demand for oil and natural gas could be so reduced that the price could be rolled back to 1950s prices; pennies on the current dollar. Why is that not a positive outcome? Because the oil companies don't want the collapsing of oil demand, and their neo fascist government doesn't want the down trading of oil to effect the wallstreet economy. The Asians on the other hand don't give a rats ass about our neo fascist economy. Even the Chinese are forging ahead in leaps and bounds with alternative/renewable energy.